Mutual Benefit, the project of songwriter Jordan Lee, sings of a massive flame that tears through the land on his Growing At The Edges track “Season Of Flame.” The song describes the feeling of looking out into a wasteland after a fire has blazed through, and the want to imagine another, better world that comes in the wake of destruction. That longing for a better world is something we can all relate to. But rather than focusing on the ruin, Mutual Benefit is more interested in the growth that follows.
As a whole, Lee’s fourth studio album Growing At The Edges is a meditation on change and transformation. “I became interested in the unruly first signs of growth after a disaster, and the beautiful ways lives start to blur into each other through relationships,” Lee said of the album in a statement. “Edges are where spaces are negotiated.”
As someone who makes self-described as “astral folk” music, Mutual Benefit’s songs are transportive. Throughout 10 tenderhearted tracks, Growing At The Edges examines changes both in the world and in Lee himself. It was also inspired by classical and jazz radio stations he’d listen to during lockdown, which comes through on the various tranquil instrumental tracks.
Celebrating the impending release of Growing At The Edges, Lee sits down with Uproxx to talk Joanna Newsom, opossums, and the fear of being misunderstood in our latest Q&A.
What are four words you would use to describe your music?
Contemplative, ornate, catchy, evocative.
It’s 2050 and the world hasn’t ended and people are still listening to your music. How would you like it to be remembered?
My hope for listeners in 2050 is the same as it is now, for my music to be a little portal where people can visit and hopefully feel some catharsis or comfort. I hope Mutual Benefit will still sound good through Amazon brain implant surveillance and shopping modules.
Who’s the person who has most inspired your work, and why?
Back in the early days of Tumblr there was a bi-coastal collective called FMLY that inspired a lot of the ethos and trajectory of my music career. They championed the sort of DIY, book your own tour, record your own music, make your own cassette label, find the other freaks in your town and book shows in your kitchen sort of mentality that gave me permission to think of myself as a musician instead of a poser who needed outside permission to release music.
Where did you eat the best meal of your life and what was it?
A narrowly-missed slice from Pizza Suprema in NYC after a long flight from Montana.
Tell us about the best concert you’ve ever attended.
Joanna Newsom solo at El Museo del Barrio in Harlem. I was in a post-tour depressive slump and my partner surprised me with tickets. At the show she was effortlessly switching between piano and harp, sometimes mid-song, and masterfully reinterpreting these huge arrangements into their most important parts. It was absolutely spiritual to me.
What song never fails to make you emotional?
“River Man” by Nick Drake. The arrangement transports me like few other songs. The picked guitar part feels like rowing, the strings seem to be asking a question which the lyrics don’t answer, and instead the music just partially resolves. Just like life! I’m listening right now and getting emotional, mission accomplished haha.
What’s the last thing you Googled?
“Do opossums live in Rhode Island?”
Where’s the weirdest place you’ve ever crashed while on tour?
One memory that comes to mind is sleeping in a treehouse in Providence but getting awoken by what I think was a huge possum. I freaked out and ran back inside to sleep on the floor, it was so scary!
What’s your favorite city in the world to perform and what’s the city you hope to perform in for the first time?
I really like playing in Scotland. Something about the rowdy crowds, the weird sense of humor, the big bearded men who become sensitive after a couple pints. I love it, especially Glasgow. I’ve never performed anywhere besides North America and Western Europe and would absolutely love to play outside of that bubble someday. It feels more meaningful to be “invited” into a new country by a band or organization who is excited about my work instead of just randomly booking it so I’m biding my time…
What’s one piece of advice you’d go back in time to give to your 18-year-old self?
I’d probably tell my 18 year old self to be less afraid of making mistakes but honestly I just found my journals from when I was that age and I miss the world feeling so open and new and feeling things so hard. Maybe I should get some advice from my teenager self haha.
What’s one of your hidden talents?
I can make a new friend within twenty minutes of sitting at an airport bar.
If you had a million dollars to donate to charity, what cause would you support and why?
I’m a lot more interested in creating the conditions where the idea of charity doesn’t need to exist. That being said, I would redistribute that money to projects in my neighborhood doing mutual aid and food justice work like Brooklyn Supported Agriculture which is a Black-led cooperative that sources, packs, and distributes fruits and veggies. I’ve been admiring their efforts to take something as foundational as food supply and reimagining it as a more just system.
What are your thoughts about AI and the future of music?
I see AI’s impact on the future of music as an extension of what is already happening when people whose main goal is to chase maximum profits are in charge of how music gets made and distributed. I’ve seen so much change happen in the 14 years my band has existed like the importance of catering to social media platforms, switching from posting songs to 15 second snippets of the catchiest moment, to touring though venues that are increasingly monopolized and corporatized. If there’s already rigid formulas and aesthetics for getting music to succeed on these platforms, why not have AI do it?
Still, I do have faith in underground and non-commercial music communities. I think there will always be interesting things happening, including right now. I just wish the economics of it were more fair and there was more incentive to be creative.
You are throwing a music festival. Give us the dream lineup of 5 artists that will perform with you and the location it would be held.
I like the idea of an outside camping festival somewhere beautiful like a desolate Big Sur type landscape where there is mountain, forest, and ocean at the same time. A manageable amount of people come, like 200 or so, and there would be music stations set up in different locations where people could collaborate to make ambient music, atmospheric music. The goal would be to make sure each location would be making some sort of sound at all times and that a wide range of people could use the music stations at any time. People could meditate, read, write poetry, nap, whatever.
Who’s your favorite person to follow on Twitter and/or Instagram?
I see they’ve calmed down a bit, but there were a couple years where the US Consumer Product Safety Commission (@USCPSC) was absolutely unhinged on twitter. They would make up these characters like Pasta Frog or The Eye of Destiny. I definitely wish more federal agencies used twitter for the sake of surrealist memes.
What’s the story behind your first or favorite tattoo?
I don’t have any but on tour I’ve highly considered getting 3 diagonally stacked hearts as an homage to the Love’s logo because their bathrooms are so clean. In parts of the country it is like an oasis in the desert.
What is your pre-show ritual?
I like to practice harmonies with the band while jumping and rolling around to get all my nervous energy out and be loose for the show.
Who was your first celebrity crush?
Lady Marian from Disney’s Robin Hood. Take that as you will.
You have a month off and the resources to take a dream vacation. Where are you going and who is coming with you?
I heard there is a long mountain trail in Japan where you can visit the Shinto temples and camp. Doing something like that would be a dream. I’d bring my girlfriend along if it sounded fun and not miserable to her.
What is your biggest fear?
To be misunderstood.
Growing At The Edges is out 10/6 via Transgressive. Find more information here.